#103 - Interview with Thomas Hofmeyer - From America to Switzerland: A Clash of Systems

00:00:00: Today, we have a very special guest in the podcast Thomas Hofmeier.

00:00:05: He brings an international perspective to leadership and supply chain management.

00:00:10: born in South Africa To A German father And The Belgian mother with French as his mother tongue he grew up across France Belgium and predominantly Sweden and lived and worked In the US.

00:00:22: here's lift in Switzerland for seventeen years now where?

00:00:27: and a voluntary firefighter.

00:00:33: Thomas has built an extensive career across global logistics, supply chain management.

00:00:39: Today we will talk about very important topic Liberalism and the liberal political systems.

00:00:46: And how liberal is Switzerland?

00:01:06: Thomas Hofmeier thank you so much for being in the podcast.

00:01:13: I would like to start the conversation with you, because i know quite well now.

00:01:19: We've been friends for a minute and uh... You lived in the

00:01:24: U.S.,

00:01:25: it was over ten years or early adulthood years.

00:01:29: What made you go into the US?

00:01:31: what was your motivation?

00:01:32: maybe you can elaborate about that little bit.

00:01:35: Sure thanks for having me.

00:01:38: The first opportunity I had to go there was through an athletic scholarship for university and two play tennis.

00:01:48: And that was actually my plan B, because in high school years it would be to go to Stockholm School Economics but very difficult to get into there.

00:01:58: Plan B basically offered me to study almost free from tennis scholarships.

00:02:04: I did grow up mostly in Sweden, where pretty much all the TV series and movies are American usually.

00:02:14: That's why they're so good at English as well right?

00:02:16: No... That plus that language is Anglo-Saxon.

00:02:19: you know it was close to English and German.

00:02:23: So i think had a strong influence of culture growing up basically when option came up And wanted use this plan B You know definitely went for And that was the first time I moved to the US.

00:02:37: Was there anything particular, made you excited about U.S culture?

00:02:43: Sure!

00:02:46: First what i saw in the series which is always grandiose and big things... Big happenings..big country....big stuff.

00:02:55: But once your'e here ,I would say if I reflect more on my feeling when it's there The main things I really liked was the choice.

00:03:07: Really, the variety and width of choices.

00:03:10: where it is you want to go eat or buy something Or try out a sport You wanna experience some culture.

00:03:21: There's alot of choice in life in US A big variety I would say.

00:03:30: the other main thing that really liked was we did a lot of traveling.

00:03:34: The first year, through the tennis team and also personally so on And it's still very easy to travel there.

00:03:42: You know anywhere you go where you have motels everywhere.

00:03:45: It is easier to travel by car or if you choose to do it by bus or airplane whatever you wish But its'a very easily to travel in this country.

00:03:55: So i think thats another thing that attracted me.

00:03:59: But other than that, it's probably mainly the spirit of people in this country.

00:04:04: People are very open and I'm a fairly sociable person so its easy to connect with them.

00:04:10: maybe more difficult to have lasting relationships but nothing is perfect or too easy for life.

00:04:18: The spirit can do things like meet others.

00:04:23: They want to try new things.

00:04:26: So you have an

00:04:28: entrepreneurial spirit there which is prominent, what do you say?

00:04:32: It's definitely more prominent than in Sweden where I grew up... ...I'm not sure if it's more prominent then Switzerland but it's definitely a bit more prominent because besides this can't-do attitude and wanna-do attitudes People also are more in a survival mode than in Europe.

00:04:54: In Europe, we have this whole system of if you lose your job there's insurance for that.

00:05:03: There is lot more support systems For those type situations That don't happen US which means You know...you have to work and succeed and perform to have a decent life in the US.

00:05:14: You know, there's that pressure is different than Europe for sure.

00:05:17: So you think it causes also lot of stress maybe or... Is like a curse and blessing at same time?

00:05:24: Yeah

00:05:25: That's good question For sure.

00:05:28: I don't think its country for people who dont' have ambitions They want live off the state or other people, things like that.

00:05:37: That's probably not the best choice of country to live in now.

00:05:41: so sure

00:05:42: a little bit lazy.

00:05:43: maybe it's not the Best Country Or Not As Vicious?

00:05:47: Well some you do have Some Lazy People.

00:05:51: They're Successful Through Cunning Ways Probably In Other Ways Right?

00:05:56: So No There Is Definitely A Mix Of People That Succeed And Have A Good Life There.

00:06:02: But at some point, you do have to perform.

00:06:05: You do have the deliver because people and companies pay for what they deliver not just theoretical things in general.

00:06:14: Thomas I would like talk about a sports system as we know it very well The whole scholarship system.

00:06:23: I mean it starts, I believe from high school on and then goes up to college And then you get into professional sports.

00:06:29: How is it different here in Europe?

00:06:32: Do you think maybe describe the support how works like especially From a young age to a professional or going from a professional Maybe or semi-professional back into the workforce?

00:06:48: can you describe that little bit I

00:06:49: would say the main difference in U.S versus Europe is that it's very integrated into educational system, pretty much and doesn't start just high school starts already.

00:07:02: lower grades middle schools where most of those schools have different teams or sports teams.

00:07:09: sometimes if its a bigger school with several hundreds thousand students they'll.

00:07:15: They have like three teams per sports or something, I mean it's really... Sports

00:07:19: is a big factor in society as well.

00:07:22: Like the school system education system?

00:07:24: Well It is because everybody has to go to school at least till certain age right and they're faced with those sports teams that their schools.

00:07:33: So the main difference then Europe.

00:07:34: you know people grew up mostly going through local club so The city of town.

00:07:39: You now one more clubs for different sports And thats'the main difference.

00:07:43: You do have some club sports in the US, but that would say the main exposure of most people is through their educational system.

00:07:51: And like you said it goes on to university afterwards.

00:07:54: and what Do think can you learn from having played sports also for your professional life?

00:08:02: I Think he learned a lot.

00:08:04: i mean and It applies too A lot Of sports.

00:08:07: now you Have individual sports have team Sports so they bring different things To The table But Most of the Sports.

00:08:14: If you want to succeed, teach at least that discipline and what it takes to succeed in sports.

00:08:22: And then life if your team's sport maybe also requires quite a bit of leadership... ...if you wanna be successful on the team.

00:08:33: So I think those are probably key things.

00:08:36: At end all has to do with social skills because even in individual sports, you're going to be confronted by the club people or coaches and things like that.

00:08:49: And being able to succeed with those people... You also have to know how to communicate with these people in an effective manner.

00:08:58: So discipline leadership communication conflict management and maybe endurance as well?

00:09:03: Sure yeah I mean I don't know of endurance.

00:09:07: For sure, for sports you need physical endurance but it has more to do with the persistence that we don't give up.

00:09:14: basically right?

00:09:16: You learn very quickly in sports if you give up too quickly and not achieve anything which is similar as an adult.

00:09:26: So yes, I think there's some really good simulations.

00:09:29: And Tom later on of all the places you went to why did he come to Switzerland?

00:09:34: Such a small country from the big

00:09:36: U.S.,

00:09:37: what happened?

00:09:38: After the US i went back to Sweden for short while and whilst was there it had hunted for jobs in different places around the world.

00:09:46: I think one head hunter did influence me, maybe a little bit because he said you know Tom would speak fluent German and English in French.

00:09:53: Switzerland is probably the place we'll have a lot of opportunities now.

00:09:57: i was familiar with switzerland having a vacation here when i was a child my father being retired at the border on the french side.

00:10:04: so i did have some exposure to it by then.

00:10:07: being you know in my late twenties I also had some understanding of the political system in Switzerland and what's going on here, from an economic point-of view.

00:10:18: There was a lot there that attracted me for sure... ...in those parts as well.

00:10:25: How would you say is Switzerland in terms of political or economic systems different?

00:10:30: Or similar to the US?

00:10:33: The main difference is it has direct democracy while the U.S is a representative of democracy, and that's the main difference but also between Switzerland and all other democracies in the world because it's only direct democracy in the well.

00:10:49: But there does have a lot of similitudes.

00:10:51: The federalism of course Is key one.

00:10:56: I mean There probably is good basis for facts That Switzerland did model itself after both American constitution And model.

00:11:06: So, besides the federalism I would say that the main simulitude is liberalism.

00:11:26: did wants to have strong liberalism embedded in that system.

00:11:32: Yeah, it has a strong liberal tradition... That's true!

00:11:35: Why do you prefer a liberal system compared with other political systems?

00:11:43: I mean i'm a member of the Liberal Party in Switzerland so obviously that is definitely my preference.

00:11:51: no doubt about that.

00:11:56: the basis of liberalism, just definition-wise but also what I see it and understand to be is individual freedom.

00:12:06: And that's in your individual rights or property right.

00:12:10: Basically individuals either were companies are individual.

00:12:14: people can manage themselves best.

00:12:18: you know everything.

00:12:19: life very complex personal life family life business even sometimes deciding what to do for vacation.

00:12:27: I mean, everything is complex in life and there's nobody better than yourself... ...to know what you want or don't wanna do in those choices whether it be a company or person.

00:12:44: And anytime there has been attempts to centralize this and have other people decide for others on the best of them.

00:12:53: I think we have enough examples now after, you know, a hundred fifty to two years of that where it usually ends up with the disaster for everybody basically.

00:13:02: So do you think Switzerland individual rights are pretty much there protected also compared to other countries such as France Germany Italy?

00:13:12: What do you say?

00:13:13: Yeah, I would say Switzerland is probably in the top five.

00:13:17: In respect and protection of individual rights...

00:13:21: In Europe or

00:13:22: globally?

00:13:23: Globally!

00:13:24: But sadly just like everywhere in a globe they're being eroded.

00:13:29: Now i think that's complex question That will take time to go into depth.

00:13:34: For me it was the main reason for them to be eroded.

00:13:40: There are several, it's very complex but I would say urbanism is one of the key reasons.

00:13:45: It's that people all over the world not just a Western World they're moving to cities and once people move into cities They have different needs, different ambitions And exposed to different philosophies in different aspects of life and politics.

00:14:02: That was probably one of their key reasons.

00:14:06: Plus you have certain Opposite philosophies that came about, you know on the end of the eighteen hundreds begin nineteen hundreds That became very popular

00:14:16: such as

00:14:17: communism would be one of them.

00:14:20: I mean there's many anti-liberal philosophies out there and Sadly, because of different human factors I would say and macroeconomical factors like urbanism they became popular.

00:14:32: And sadly there's still a poplar... ...and even more.

00:14:35: sadly some become even more popular now than ten years ago or twenty years ago right?

00:14:41: So these are one the reasons why not just in Switzerland but everywhere.

00:14:47: you know liberalism is sadly getting eroded quite a bit And therefore, I think it's very important that we do what we can't for the people who believe in the success of liberalism.

00:15:00: For individuals and economy and so on... ...that at least preserve them if not try to push back and reverse the title as much as possible.

00:15:12: What kind of measures could you implement?

00:15:16: on these movements such as Marxism, Socialism.

00:15:20: I mean what would be one measure that you would implement for example or tell people to promote?

00:15:28: Well the basis i would say and main thing is have at least amount of involvement in peoples lives and companies business by state.

00:15:40: And how are they involved?

00:15:41: why do they involve themselves?

00:15:43: by creating laws rules then enforcing them and penalizing people from not, companies who are not following them.

00:15:50: So the main thing you can do is to deregulate.

00:15:55: You know for example we're here in Zurich where there's at least twenty thirty thousand apartments too less For the amount of demand Huge demands

00:16:03: for living space

00:16:05: huh?

00:16:06: There a lot of people out there that have money And want to build these apartments but it either It's too painful for them to do it right now or the ROI, return investment is just not there because they have to go through a lot of rules basically.

00:16:25: This is prime example.

00:16:26: I think that if we lessen the rules and people are motivated then have capital in order to allocate this and want to build that will let us do so you know?

00:16:38: And then that positive is there for everyone if this gets done better, right?

00:16:42: Tom I would like to also talk about the economic system in US versus Switzerland.

00:16:48: Where do you see similarities and differences?

00:16:52: So similarities again i will say it is liberalism.

00:16:57: It's easier to create a business in Switzerland than most other countries of the world.

00:17:04: I believe Switzerland is number one in the current ranking of how quickly you can set up a business.

00:17:09: Globally?

00:17:12: Yes, so it's around twenty days and twenty-one days.

00:17:15: on average The US is probably about thirty days And this much better than most countries in the world.

00:17:24: Plus you have less corruption to deal with also In that system process then in most countries.

00:17:31: Oddly for me is not number one in the least corrupt country in the world.

00:17:35: I believe Sweden is ranked there and Switzerland is top five

00:17:40: Number One corruption.

00:17:41: from the last two last studies, I've read yes like i mean i grew up in sweden And Sweden is much less liberal than Switzerland, in general overall.

00:17:53: In some aspects they're actually more liberal in business.

00:17:57: so I'm a little bit surprised by that ranking.

00:17:59: but you know rankings have different factors of measurements and then are perfect either.

00:18:05: But anyway your asking me about similitudes and dissimilitude.

00:18:08: So the similitude is the liberalism.

00:18:11: for sure It's easier to set up a business.

00:18:17: Also, the similitude is that because they're both federal states you have some overarching rules of how to set up and conduct business in Switzerland as an US which is helpful.

00:18:35: In not having too many different types of setups or systems do your businesses basically right?

00:18:43: The dissimilitudes I would say The biggest one is probably language because here in Switzerland, you know if you want to do business You might need to sell a product label it Your service and three or maybe even four languages.

00:19:02: Probably three or four with English, right?

00:19:06: On top of the four official languages in Switzerland.

00:19:09: And not

00:19:09: everybody speaks French and Italian in Switzerland!

00:19:12: Correct

00:19:13: correct?

00:19:13: so I would say to me that's the main difference a hundred percent all right.

00:19:18: now luckily it is you know, luckily or unluckily English and the English language is influencing more life in business in Europe.

00:19:30: This positive for ease of business I would say communication because you need to do business.

00:19:38: The sad part.

00:19:39: maybe the cultural parts Because i think that we need a balance on everything And I don't think it's good for Switzerland if we become too Anglo-Saxon or to English and lose, you know the culture.

00:19:53: The cultures that would do have here?

00:19:55: I totally agree...I may have to brush up my French as a matter of fact.

00:19:59: Tom!

00:20:00: We have great history also of liberal thinkers.

00:20:04: which liberal thinker influenced you?

00:20:08: Well It goes in.

00:20:10: It's gone in different phases, I would say.

00:20:14: As you read new thinkers' books as you meet also current contemporary thinkers... which is one of the first ones you usually read about in their high school or colleges, Adam Smith with Invisible Hands and things like that.

00:20:35: I would say it was probably my first contact to those types of philosophies... ...I grew up also into a French educational system studies of the Greek philosophers, and I would say some of them also had quite a bit influence on me towards liberal thinking.

00:20:56: The Greeks also be considered as liberal thinkers?

00:20:59: Well not all the Greeks but some other Greeks for sure.

00:21:04: if you consider how the rest of world looked like two thousand years ago And that they actually have this sort of democracies while the rest in the world were either had kings or tribal leaders.

00:21:17: That's quite a stark difference, right?

00:21:20: Definitely more liberal than what others were doing.

00:21:24: But in the last few years I'm getting myself more acquainted with more of contemporary thinkers.

00:21:33: The one that has influenced me most at least two or three years is Thomas Sowell from US who was still alive.

00:21:41: I believe he's ninety-four years old.

00:21:43: He is

00:21:43: a professor or something,

00:21:44: right?

00:21:45: He's not a professor but still a senior fellow from the Hoover Institute at Stanford and actually active.

00:21:51: you can see interviews with him just last year on YouTube and other channels so on.

00:22:00: The main thing that struck me was many books is the difference between constrained and unconstrained visions.

00:22:13: What does that mean?

00:22:15: Basically, you know there's a lot of philosophies in systems among political systems are constrained and un-constrained And the main difference between constraint or unconstraining is that Constraints they measure and think about consequences their actions decisions and constraints A lot less You know, so to compare famous philosophies you know basically communism is definitely more on the unconstrained side of things which means they want a certain type of equality and equity.

00:22:55: And obviously there's enough proof that didn't really care how it got there.

00:23:00: if millions died either they killed them or out of poverty.

00:23:06: For them it was worth towards this goal of theirs basically, right?

00:23:12: Well even among us liberals there are liberals with more constrained and some with more unconstrained visions.

00:23:20: I think we see that in Switzerland just on last couple years.

00:23:24: for me i think the... We've made some unliberal and liberal errors in past couple year because people had more unconstrate vision.

00:23:35: I would say that we went ahead with COVID laws and restricted people from living, moving to the restaurant doing their business.

00:23:46: If they didn't take a certain vaccine or so on... That for me is definitely more on the unconstrained side of divisions.

00:23:58: basically there was this alleged hope goal.

00:24:03: if you force them do it

00:24:05: i.e.,

00:24:06: we don't really care about taking away their liberties, this would be the greater good of

00:24:10: society.".

00:24:11: Well I think already now just a couple years after that there's enough proof and I think there are enough sentiments across the population that probably was not the best way to go.

00:24:21: The Liberal Party promoted the Covid laws?

00:24:26: Maybe it won't goes as far saying they promoted them but the party itself did along with it.

00:24:34: Now, I think this is more related to the very strong consensus culture that we have in Switzerland.

00:24:42: The Minister of Health back then was from one party but he wasn't charged with health and other six members.

00:24:54: they always try to reach a consensus together.

00:24:56: It's part of the culture, it is part of system and that person probably asked for this much.

00:25:03: but at end we had this much because there was this consensus discussions among them in different parties political actors so I'm not sure The liberal party promoted it, but at the end they did go along with that on a certain level.

00:25:23: But now back to

00:25:24: normal hopefully?

00:25:27: Well I think sadly the risk is... ...that's the political system saw there was no revolution against this Which means probably they can do again and then be fine.

00:25:41: Hopefully enough lessons learned of the impact, or social impacts even on children sadly.

00:25:49: That had to go through that I mean my daughter had to wear a mask at three years old you know?

00:25:55: Or she couldn't go to her school for couple weeks.

00:25:58: This is not even half as extreme as many other countries did including the US which was supposed be the bastion of liberalism in The Eyes Of The World.

00:26:08: In certain areas of the US, you weren't even allowed to swim in the ocean.

00:26:13: There's famous videos now about a surfer being tackled as he steps out of water by the sheriffs on the beach because he is surfing during COVID.

00:26:22: Things that not blew our minds but actually happened and we sort-of let it happen right?

00:26:26: I mean there was no revolution against this really...

00:26:28: I had to wear a mask at forty two years old age!

00:26:32: Yeah still feels weird thinking about it.

00:26:35: Tom You talked about Adam Smith just before.

00:26:39: Just out of curiosity, do you think if he would apply the Adam Smith philosophy one-to-one to our current society?

00:26:46: Would that work?

00:26:49: Sure but I'm not sure that people... That majority is fifty-one percent since Switzerland and we know we go by strict majority.

00:26:57: I am not so sure that simple or strict majority of people in Switzerland will be okay with it.

00:27:03: It's too insecure for them knowing what this means.

00:27:09: Basically, it would be too much of the wild west for people nowadays especially from a big city.

00:27:15: I think that more in the countryside they're used to being you know more in survival mode and close-to-nature... ...I think they will probably okay with them because their'e closer than nature.. ..and that is nature basically.

00:27:28: Nature is the invisible hand and thats also where Adam Smith and most philosophers where they observed and based their conclusion was from observing nature, not just people in the city but also nature itself.

00:27:45: So Tom why do you see regulation

00:27:48: as

00:27:48: something necessary or maybe in your case a necessary evil?

00:27:51: Or what do you think government is still necessary in this society?

00:27:55: Well since at least us hardcore libertarians and liberals believe that there needs to be respect for private property And for my individual rights,

00:28:06: i.e.,

00:28:07: that you're not allowed to just come here and punch me in the face... ...and there's no consequence.

00:28:11: So basically I'm entitled to live my life healthy.

00:28:15: Thankyou very much!

00:28:18: You do need rules to protect those things That you are now allowed murdering or harming Or stealing your property.

00:28:28: those rules on either side.

00:28:29: So property

00:28:30: rights,

00:28:31: individual rights of living here?

00:28:34: Yeah.

00:28:34: protection

00:28:35: yeah

00:28:36: and maybe on top of that obviously rules protecting the society.

00:28:42: we have chosen to live together right.

00:28:44: so Switzerland you know we've chosen to leave here if not Swiss at least there by the rules which means that you need to have a protection for the integrity of Switzerland as a country, uh...which mean is you do new rules for uh...for the border right?

00:29:02: The integrity at least.

00:29:04: Other than this in the liberalism I believe and You did not needs many other rules.

00:29:11: so border control migration policies individual rights property rights

00:29:19: Well, you need rules on migration policy once you've decided to have a welfare system.

00:29:24: And we have decided that in Switzerland and I would say.

00:29:27: for me sadly it's growing because that is not very liberal thing the welfare systems which are put into place.

00:29:35: but when they're chosen as a system of that level then you do have to have immigration rules to protect them.

00:29:42: otherwise the system will break apart most of our neighbors north, south and west of us.

00:29:51: Neighboring

00:29:51: countries?

00:29:52: Countries

00:29:53: are going bankrupt because the welfare system that they decide to go ahead did not protect it in a certain way And now its gonna bankrupt the whole country.

00:30:03: basically right It's already very close for certain countries

00:30:06: And it seems like Switzerland is only oasis almost within all those nations In Europe.

00:30:13: The bigger countries

00:30:15: In a sense, yes.

00:30:16: Since the EU countries have open borders between themselves and also outwards but we do have few neighbors that are not members of the EU you know, that are protecting their borders fairly well.

00:30:31: So we're not the only ones but were among a few left us for shortness.

00:30:35: Yeah I'm gonna continue to ask about European Union would be another podcast.

00:30:40: But Tom what kind of liberal will you consider yourself?

00:30:44: You mentioned earlier Libertarian so would you call yourselves a libertarian?

00:30:48: Yes i would And I touched on earlier what is for me a libertarianism.

00:30:56: It's basically that all we believe the state needs to be involved in, protecting the borders and protecting our property rights and individual right of life and liberty – everything else.

00:31:09: people communities on the different levels, businesses should be able to manage themselves much better than with interaction of state and rules.

00:31:21: And Tom can you talk also about some liberal success stories in terms governments?

00:31:27: You mentioned now Switzerland obviously.

00:31:30: are there any other countries that come through your mind?

00:31:35: Well one I think is very special And it's really truly amazing to me is Lichtenstein, which has really close to us here I mean physically and so on and culturally because they even use our currency in our police.

00:31:49: What the most amazing for me Is that you know The Prince Michael of Lichtenstein.

00:31:56: He almost has ultimate power if he wants too.

00:32:00: In this sense So

00:32:02: could

00:32:02: be a dictator?

00:32:03: Yes he sort-of wanted To but his actually ranked maybe number two enough to melee from Argentina as the most liberal and libertarian head of state in the world.

00:32:13: And that for me is truly something mind-blowing because, you know... As a famous Greek philosopher said power corrupts.

00:32:22: an absolute power corrupt absolutely which means it's very rare when we meet people who have more power than us and actually don't abuse it.

00:32:34: On the contrary, there may be more modest than us or you know... ...more constrained in assuming that power against others.

00:32:44: to me those are most impressive communities people countries where we see this type of actions.

00:32:53: How do you see Argentina now with new government seems quite successful at the moment?

00:33:00: Well, if you look at certain metrics it would be difficult to say that they're not.

00:33:08: Their main issue was inflation and even hyperinflation.

00:33:12: They still have high inflation but the trend is definitely gone in a better direction.

00:33:20: He's already done a lot to deregulate, so you're already seeing quite a bit of optimism in not just social life but the business community and Argentina.

00:33:32: You also see certain big neighbors like US interacting much more positively because they see this common philosophy together at least economical liberalism which means that the country and people have a lot more opportunities also now to grow their economy, growth of businesses.

00:33:53: Tom you're also family man.

00:33:55: how do you think liberalism affects the family life?

00:34:00: That's good question.

00:34:01: as I said i believe these are pan-life philosophies.

00:34:11: it applies in same way.

00:34:14: You know, it's not for me to constrain or use power onto my daughter... ...or my wife's liberty of choice.

00:34:27: Physical property if my wife decides and goes a car with you And she wants the main one using that car.

00:34:38: I shouldn't be able do and go in and constrain that, say no sorry I have more physical power than decision-power.

00:34:46: therefore i'm going to be using my car more then you.

00:34:49: That might be a silly example but basically every person we interact with within life there's a power dynamic right?

00:34:59: And the liberalism is basically the power that you have against their individual freedom or Their property, or stealing their property.

00:35:10: Or abusing a property and I think if you think more than few seconds You can think of lot of examples like that also in family life.

00:35:18: What about work-life balance?

00:35:20: Like where do you see like?

00:35:22: because obviously In order to achieve that kind of freedom you also need too Yeah Work hard become achieve certain success to have that freedom.

00:35:32: But until you get there, how do you manage the work-life balance?

00:35:37: That's almost two or three questions.

00:35:38: One is a complex question which I haven't thought about so that's very good question.

00:35:47: What comes to your mind?

00:35:49: Even if you decide to be hermit and go live in woods And don't have a job You're still going Deliver and be an work hard.

00:36:01: Otherwise, you won't even survive right now because if you don't see no choir skills And then how to hunt and keep yourself sheltered or so on?

00:36:10: So actually You know it applies to urban life as a place that any type of life basically write To be successful.

00:36:19: for.

00:36:19: I mean what is success in?

00:36:20: what does the balance have worked like?

00:36:22: balance?

00:36:23: It is Basically most probably from me at least since you asked me is that's you know is that you and your loved ones, live a fulfilled life.

00:36:34: And have their property in individual rights protected right?

00:36:39: So for me one of my responsibilities to make sure my family has those things respected and protected Is To Make Sure That They're Safe That Our Property Is Safe That Nobody Impeds On Our Liberties.

00:36:53: Basically Right.

00:36:55: But For The Work-Life Balance I think that's a more complex thing.

00:37:02: You have to be efficient, because the more efficient you are at work or your'e home... ...the more free time and time you've got to balance with other things right?

00:37:13: So i think for me it would need good performance in everything you know, taking care and living with your family at work in your business for entrepreneurs like you.

00:37:29: You have to perform... And the more efficient you are and the more performed The more time will we'll have over To do other things.

00:37:35: That's where I think that you gain the work-life balance quality.

00:37:39: basically

00:37:41: Tom, the West has a huge demographic problem.

00:37:45: How does liberalism solve this issue?

00:37:51: I would say, for me the liberalism is that you do allow people to move here.

00:38:01: That wants to adhere to the rules and system we've decided have here... ...that bring necessary skills of value which are needed to substitute with the lack of our own people, our own kids growing up and being there for that.

00:38:21: So... That's also what liberalism brings to the table is if you're not too illiberal about your immigration policies but obviously they have to work as many peoples possible then it enables us to continue.

00:38:43: But it is not liberalism that's going to solve the demography question.

00:38:48: I think, again... ...that comes back a lot too.

00:38:52: urbanism That when people move to cities they have less children.

00:38:56: It also has lots of things to do with other things.

00:39:01: They're not necessarily tied to liberalism but maybe so.

00:39:04: For example most studies study why does Why do people have more or less children?

00:39:11: And they've compared different countries and different cities, in different systems.

00:39:15: Actually to my recollection the main factor is... The lower child birth death is so that the least amount of your children dying as children actually that society will have.

00:39:33: So because I would say thanks liberals we had such Advancements in health care, you know quality of healthcare and quality of natal healthcare.

00:39:44: We've had a drastic change In the last twenty thirty fifty hundred years an amount Of children that died at young age because we have better prenatal than natal care.

00:39:54: basically right?

00:39:57: And that is what I've read at least, it's actually the key factor why people have less children and i would say number two is probably their urbanism factor.

00:40:06: That when you move to big cities because of constraints or different needs and wants in a city where they just don't have kids.

00:40:13: And so your saying like liberal policies are not cause for demographic problem its more urbanization.

00:40:25: What was the pill, the contraception?

00:40:31: That is also a innovation and I do believe that most innovations come out of liberalism.

00:40:38: If you compare which countries, universities or systems create the most innovation in my mind at least there's enough proof.

00:40:47: it's usually more than the liberal ones if we look historically and even contemporarily.

00:40:54: So those actually are root causes, the main root cause is maybe then liberalism.

00:40:59: Is that because liberalism creates so much innovation through science and other systems?

00:41:07: The end result is our lives.

00:41:10: it's easy.

00:41:13: And we think more about things than nature.

00:41:19: We think more about our individual happiness, about culture because we have so much free time.

00:41:25: Because life is so easy and... More comfort

00:41:28: than Netflix?

00:41:29: That!

00:41:30: And I do believe that the more you use your time for those things, doom-scrolling on Facebook or Instagram –because there's enough money to do it– The least we're focused on or the least were using and sensing our urges, unnatural urges to have children.

00:41:49: And then there's also propaganda sadly from different parts of last you know almost hundred years that actually uh...there are too many people around.

00:42:00: It's not good to have too many kids.

00:42:02: I mean, there is even propaganda from different philosophies on that and obviously it doesn't help.

00:42:08: And finally Tom...I've a question that i'd love to ask my guest in each episode.

00:42:15: if you were to pick a superpower next your current super power set what would you pick?

00:42:22: If you had the opportunity gain an additional superpower walk out of studio now

00:42:28: Which one would you pick?

00:42:29: It's a good question.

00:42:32: I will refer back to what i said about the prince Michael Lucienstein, that is super power because there are so few people in life we meet who can be so liberal when they have more power than others and have a lot of power over other people yet remain liberal and respectful for their rights because otherwise more people would have it.

00:43:01: And there's extremely few people of a lot power that had.

00:43:05: on the contrary, I think you know just by reading The Daily News we can see enough examples of people are not going to name names That abuse their power right?

00:43:14: Their individual...the power they have individually or with their political party or country Or their tribe and others or community in other communities.

00:43:22: I think we read and find out mostly.

00:43:27: And it seems to be on Pareto level, sadly the fact that most people abuse... ...the power they have.

00:43:33: so my superpower would be able to constrain that more.. ..and make sure i almost never abuse any type of power over other individuals wherever there are.

00:43:45: Final question if you were to buy autobiography which one will you buy?

00:43:52: Which one I choose to read?

00:43:53: That's a good question.

00:43:58: It would probably be the one of the Prince of Lichtenstein I mean, you know he is.

00:44:04: it really triggered me in many ways The last couple years and finding out how could that be?

00:44:10: Because it just really blows

00:44:12: my mind.

00:44:12: basically Thank You so much Tom!

00:44:15: Was wonderful conversation.

00:44:17: Really enjoyed that.

00:44:19: See you soon.

00:44:20: Thanks for having me.

00:44:29: I appreciate it Technology.