#87 - Interview with Greg Nieuwenhuys - Former CEO & Chairman of Mammut Sports Group, Transformation and AI Leader

00:00:06: Capricorn

00:00:06: Connect.

00:00:08: People.

00:00:08: Potential.

00:00:10: Technology.

00:00:15: Super excited today.

00:00:16: We have Greg

00:00:17: Neuenhaus

00:00:18: today.

00:00:19: He was the former chief executive officer and chairman of the most iconic outdoor sports

00:00:27: brand in Switzerland, the Mammut Sports Group.

00:00:31: He helped

00:00:31: transform international consumer brands in the international arena and now he's a generative AI expert

00:00:40: and supports companies

00:00:43: revolutionizing themselves by adopting to this new technology.

00:00:48: Greg, thank you so much for being here.

00:00:49: How are you today?

00:00:51: Thank you for having me.

00:00:51: I'm looking forward to the conversation.

00:00:53: Greg, you are very passionate about outdoor sports, about endurance sports, and you are very active.

00:01:00: You also participated in competition.

00:01:04: Is there a coincidence that you also worked in the same fields?

00:01:07: Can you tell us about that?

00:01:09: Yes, I mean the answer is This is not much coincidence and it's a lot about purpose and I think you know life is We are.

00:01:20: I'm very grateful to be alive and I think life is a gift and unfortunately at some point it'll end and I think we need to make the most of it.

00:01:29: and When for example we work People spend eighty thousand hours at work.

00:01:36: It's a long time.

00:01:38: And does it matter what we do?

00:01:41: I think it matters a lot.

00:01:42: I think for me, you know, to do the things I love, it gives me energy.

00:01:47: I think it also gives the people around me energy.

00:01:50: I think the people who I work for you can feel that energy.

00:01:53: So I think it matters enormously to have purpose.

00:01:57: And I started my career as a consultant.

00:02:00: And then at some point I realized this is a great learning school, but I want to own the problems and I want to own the solutions.

00:02:10: And for me, it was quite obvious that I wanted to be in the outdoor space because I love mountains.

00:02:14: I love running.

00:02:15: I love adventure.

00:02:16: So no, it's no coincidence.

00:02:18: And how important is the purpose?

00:02:21: Because I have the feeling many people don't live their purpose, you know?

00:02:26: So what would you propose to or tell those kinds of people in terms of, yeah, fall to your passion?

00:02:33: Maybe you can tell us.

00:02:35: Yeah.

00:02:35: Well, I think, I mean, my belief is you live once.

00:02:39: So you have one shot and you can spend the time doing lots of different things.

00:02:45: And clearly life is not always easy, right?

00:02:47: There's going to be great times, there's going to be difficult times.

00:02:51: If you believe in what you're doing and you enjoy what you're doing, everything is easier.

00:02:56: Everything is more fun.

00:02:58: And I guess we all have to work.

00:03:00: Most of us have to work.

00:03:01: I have to work.

00:03:03: But why not have fun along the way and do something that matters for the world?

00:03:07: and I think it's probably more important now than ever because you and I are probably quite privileged and we can give something back and that's great for us.

00:03:17: but to be honest I think the next generation expects that from us.

00:03:20: you know I have five children and I want to be able to look at them in the eyes and say you know I think I do good.

00:03:27: I mean definitely I'm not innocent and you know there's lots of emissions going through the businesses that I'm involved in.

00:03:33: but we try to do better every day and I think for me that really matters and I can't see a world where you don't do this.

00:03:38: to be honest.

00:03:39: And Greg you've been actively involved in sports for many years.

00:03:42: You've been participating in competition sports competitions.

00:03:47: What did you learn from the sports field that also helped you in the business area?

00:03:53: Yeah I love that question.

00:03:54: I mean I'm I'm very competitive and some people like that in me and some people think it's excessive and obsessive and maybe it is.

00:04:06: I think it's now four weeks ago.

00:04:08: I was in Mallorca and I was running a race, a hundred and forty two kilometers through the mountains.

00:04:13: It took me over twenty four hours and after four hours I felt horrible and I was about to give up and I decided next day I'm going to stop.

00:04:26: Took me another hour to get to the aid station.

00:04:28: by the time I arrived something had shifted a bit and I took some parachitamol.

00:04:33: I had a soup and I decided let's just go to the next aid station because I had promised a friend I want to see the sunrise.

00:04:41: and by the time I was at the sunrise I felt great and for fifteen hours after that I felt great.

00:04:48: and so I think kind of the lesson is that life is gonna be hard.

00:04:54: business is hard.

00:04:55: there's many things that you can't control but if you keep going at that time and you just look at not the end game but the next step you can always take the next step.

00:05:05: so I think that's very important to control the things you can control and accept that sometimes you can't control and it's hard and it's how you bounce back that matters not what happens to you but how you respond.

00:05:15: so I think that's one.

00:05:16: the other one is that also just coming back to this race in those first hours I was being overtaken a lot And that sends a message of, I'm not doing so well.

00:05:28: After that aid station, I started overtaking lots of people.

00:05:31: And what that does to the brain is it tells you, you're doing well.

00:05:35: And then you see someone in front of you and say, I'm going to catch that person.

00:05:38: And you catch them.

00:05:39: And this is a constant refuelment of the mind of you're doing well.

00:05:43: And like running for twenty four hours is a mental game, right?

00:05:46: And I think the same is in business.

00:05:47: If you're winning market share or you win a new customer and you can celebrate that success with your team, it's fuel for more.

00:05:53: So I think it's a very that competitive mindset actually is.

00:05:56: I think is a gift.

00:05:57: So small wins celebrate the small wins and then also the resilience of the endurance that you learned in sports.

00:06:05: You could also apply to the business world.

00:06:08: I think so.

00:06:09: And I actually it's kind of a bit of my motto in life is you can't avoid discomfort in life.

00:06:15: And when discomfort comes to you, I think it's an opportunity for growth in any shape or form.

00:06:20: Like what I often also do.

00:06:23: when we start a meeting is I will ask a very personal question to people.

00:06:28: For example, like what?

00:06:29: For example, what's your biggest fear?

00:06:32: Or something even maybe a bit more personal.

00:06:34: But something that shifts the mind and is also a little bit awkward.

00:06:39: Because if you can create that awkwardness at the beginning of the meeting, then the ice is broken and people will be more open.

00:06:45: And after that, challenging each other, having a robust debate becomes much easier.

00:06:51: And I think it's the fact that you need to embrace the challenge.

00:06:54: When there's a crisis in a business, you need to fix it, but you need to use the opportunity to change things.

00:07:00: Apparently, something's wrong, use it.

00:07:02: So in that race, after four hours, if I hadn't had that experience, I may not have had fifteen hours where I felt so amazing.

00:07:11: So I think it's always, you can't always control what happens to you, but if you embrace the discomfort to grow, I think it's a mindset that's quite helpful.

00:07:19: Greg, I sense a little bit of a stoic philosophy there.

00:07:22: Control what you can control.

00:07:26: Yeah, I think definitely.

00:07:27: I think there's many things you can control, focus there, but also accept that many things you can't control.

00:07:33: And of course, you can try to predict and whatever, and it's good to be prepared.

00:07:36: But I think when it happens, it happens.

00:07:38: And don't get me wrong.

00:07:40: I'm not a superhero who never doubts myself, who... doesn't kind of think like oh my god why is this happening?

00:07:46: what am I gonna do?

00:07:46: no I have no idea that happens to me as well.

00:07:49: but when you can find the courage to then think like I can either sit here and and complain about it or I can try and be creative and look where's the opportunity especially when you when you're the leader you need to stand up and say hey guys we have a problem and we're gonna fix it together.

00:08:06: how are we gonna do that?

00:08:07: You're talking about leadership.

00:08:09: I would be curious to know.

00:08:11: let's say you face challenges or problems like in the business context.

00:08:15: How do you communicate to the teams?

00:08:18: Let's say you have a big challenge like what was your experience in the past here?

00:08:24: Yes, I mean that's a that's a really good question and actually I think I've My approach has changed a lot over the years.

00:08:30: in my first CEO role.

00:08:31: It was back in two thousand eleven.

00:08:32: I was thirty one.

00:08:34: I mean, I didn't really know what I was doing And I thought I just had to know everything, own everything.

00:08:40: So there was a very limited amount of vulnerability that I would share.

00:08:45: And in two thousand nineteen I had two twins that were born.

00:08:50: They were child number four and five unexpected.

00:08:53: And they were very unwell for a long time.

00:08:56: And in fact we nearly lost them multiple times.

00:08:59: And so I didn't work for about a year and a half to support my family and my wife who was also ill.

00:09:05: And I realized You know what what really matters in life?

00:09:09: It's not work.

00:09:10: It's not the house not the car you drive It's really it's your loved ones and their health.

00:09:14: all the rest doesn't matter but it.

00:09:16: I think it takes quite some special situation to realize that.

00:09:21: and Then I realized actually it's such a superpower if as a leader you can be vulnerable and you can show your vulnerability.

00:09:27: and I remember When I came to mammoth You know it had just been acquired by a private equity fund.

00:09:34: that always creates some uncertainty, a new ownership creates uncertainty.

00:09:39: And in the first kind of one hour kind of town hall, I said rather than me sharing everything, I want people to ask questions.

00:09:50: And they asked me lots of questions and I was very open.

00:09:52: And of course, if people look at someone who is vulnerable, who is open, it creates trust.

00:09:57: It creates a relationship.

00:10:00: And it also sends a message that if people make mistakes, they can come and talk to you about it.

00:10:04: And the worst thing is that when people make mistakes, they try and hide them.

00:10:07: So I think that element of vulnerability is very important.

00:10:12: And I think probably for me it's needed more than some other leaders because I'm very competitive and I'm very analytical.

00:10:19: Sometimes that can be a bit scary for people or intimidating.

00:10:23: And so I think bring that soft aside also really has helped me, I think, become a better person and a better father.

00:10:31: So people open more up when you show also your own vulnerability.

00:10:35: Is that your feeling?

00:10:36: Yes,

00:10:37: I think and I think it starts with the leader.

00:10:39: People follow the leader basically and I've seen many companies where you know sharing mistakes or owning up mistakes Doesn't happen.

00:10:48: I think it's very dangerous for the culture.

00:10:51: Greg also have a business.

00:10:52: questions about your past experiences.

00:10:55: I mean you built up a multi-channel retailer with Beaver for example.

00:10:59: So what are the Chan like?

00:11:01: the challenges in building such a company up like I think it was Initially was fifty million to a hundred million.

00:11:09: That's what I read.

00:11:10: So what were the challenges doing that?

00:11:14: I mean, this was a really fun time.

00:11:16: In the year, I was at, like I said, thirty-one.

00:11:21: I had been a consultant.

00:11:21: It was my first leadership role.

00:11:23: I had no idea.

00:11:24: So I mean, the one thing I'd say, I made lots of mistakes.

00:11:27: I made hiring mistakes.

00:11:29: I didn't manage people very well.

00:11:31: I didn't motivate people.

00:11:33: I expected that everyone was as motivated as I was and was going to work as hard as I was.

00:11:38: So I was also very frustrated.

00:11:42: But I think somehow I made.

00:11:44: I made a few bets.

00:11:45: that worked particularly around omni-channel and when I joined Baver This is two thousand eleven the website was non-transactional, so there's just only stores.

00:11:56: all the retailers in the Netherlands were complaining about online and and about omni-channel and it was it was you know big disruption and I realized quite quickly we have a we have a thirty five stores We have a CRM with half a million people in there And I realized this is not going away.

00:12:13: So I might as well embrace it and actually I realized quite quickly this is going to become our superpower.

00:12:18: If we do this well, it's going to be our weapon against the competition.

00:12:22: And I think the organization didn't really believe me.

00:12:26: But that's probably where my very persistent mindset came in.

00:12:30: I pushed really hard and the results actually followed me quite quickly.

00:12:35: I had some great people around me and it worked and it became our superpower.

00:12:40: And two years later, we won the Omni Channel Award of the year by Google, which to me was a huge surprise.

00:12:48: But I think it was a testament to the team and the belief and the results we had created and the brand that Baver is.

00:12:54: So that was a really fun journey.

00:12:56: Yeah,

00:12:56: I can believe that.

00:12:57: Greg, AI is changing the world.

00:13:00: And you are participating.

00:13:02: You're in the middle of the AI revolution.

00:13:05: So maybe you can tell us about your current project you're involved in.

00:13:08: Yes.

00:13:08: Yeah, earlier you asked me kind of why.

00:13:10: I think it's the same answer, right?

00:13:12: I realized two years ago when ChargerBT came out, I said, wow, this is going to change the world.

00:13:17: And it's going to change it very quickly.

00:13:19: And I realized you can.

00:13:20: either you can sit here and be disrupted, or you can be curious.

00:13:24: and learn.

00:13:25: and I decided for the latter and I quickly realized that you know because this is so foundational.

00:13:31: if you're going to learn around AI you need to spend quite a bit of time around AI.

00:13:34: so I ended up launching a business and I work with a team of twenty five people and I think what we do is we help business leaders and businesses understand AI and implement AI.

00:13:47: and what I've learned is that basically AI is like a stool with three legs.

00:13:52: Leg number one is obviously technology, it's generative AI, it's automation.

00:13:59: The second leg is actually business.

00:14:02: It's why does your business exist?

00:14:05: Why do your customers choose for you?

00:14:07: What is your competitive edge?

00:14:09: And how can AI make that stronger?

00:14:12: That's the kind of business question one.

00:14:13: Business question two is how is AI going to make your processes in your system more efficient?

00:14:19: The third leg, which is the most important, And the most underestimated is about people.

00:14:26: Because AI is not just a software solution that you can turn on a plug and suddenly the AI does everything for you.

00:14:34: Now it's actually every single process in the company.

00:14:37: People are using AI to do lots of different things with different tools.

00:14:41: And everywhere AI is augmenting the human.

00:14:43: It's a team interaction.

00:14:46: But that requires a very new way of working for people.

00:14:48: And it's basically the people need to be empowered to use AI.

00:14:53: Those three stools, and I realized I know business well, I know how to lead change and lead people.

00:14:59: I'm curious about AI.

00:15:01: So I started to do that.

00:15:03: And I think what I've enjoyed the most, and I just came back from Mamut now, and we've been working on AI with them this morning and yesterday, is how you can shift people from a place of overwhelm, because it changes so fast.

00:15:20: And people realize it's going to change even more.

00:15:22: And fear, like what does it mean for my job, for my company, for the education of my kids?

00:15:29: What does it mean for privacy?

00:15:32: Everyone seems to understand this but me.

00:15:34: So there is a lot of fear and overwhelm.

00:15:36: And how?

00:15:36: with a bit of education and showing them, you know, learning them how to drive a car, basically, that's the analogy I use.

00:15:44: You can shift that to excitement, understanding.

00:15:48: and the feeling that now they have a superpower.

00:15:50: They can do their job, but they can do it better.

00:15:53: And they can do it faster.

00:15:54: And along the way, they're also happier because they can focus on the things they enjoy most.

00:15:59: And the automated boring tasks can be done by the AI.

00:16:03: So for me, it means I spend more time with my customers, more time with my team, and much less time doing research or writing emails because AI does that with me.

00:16:15: So that's what we do.

00:16:16: And it's a fantastic business because every company in the world is a prospect.

00:16:22: And many companies are waking up now and realizing, wow, we need help.

00:16:27: So it's fascinating.

00:16:28: And it's moving so fast.

00:16:29: So even for me.

00:16:31: I've been very busy on a few other projects this year So I was a bit.

00:16:34: I spent less time around AI and I realized wow I need to.

00:16:37: I need to catch up because things are changing so quick.

00:16:40: Yeah exciting times.

00:16:41: talking about superpowers That's also a question.

00:16:43: I always like to ask my guests

00:16:45: if you

00:16:46: I give you a wish you can go outside and You can take a superpower with you.

00:16:52: Which one would you pick?

00:16:52: That's a great question.

00:16:55: I think my The superpower I'd like to have, that I don't really have, is the ability to stand still and to pause and reflect and celebrate success even more and be a bit more present in the moment.

00:17:14: My mind is always, I have ADHD.

00:17:17: I'm competitive, so I'm always thinking what's next.

00:17:18: That's also

00:17:19: your superpower, probably.

00:17:21: Of course, and I would like to be able to have a switch.

00:17:24: To say, now it's time to relax, and I want to turn off all these thoughts, and I want to just enjoy, relax, and be calm.

00:17:29: And then I want to turn the switch back on, and maybe that's the superpower I like.

00:17:33: And if you wanted to buy autobiography, which one would you pick?

00:17:38: Yeah, I think there's a book, I've actually read it, but it's a book I thoroughly enjoyed.

00:17:44: It matches also the conversation we have.

00:17:45: It's called Running with Purpose.

00:17:48: It's the CEO of Brooks.

00:17:51: And it talks a lot about purpose.

00:17:54: It talks a lot about running, which I love.

00:17:57: And funnily enough, it talks about Brooks.

00:17:59: as in Brooks was a small footwear running company that had to compete with Adidas, Nike, other giants.

00:18:06: And it's a little bit similar to the journey that Mamut has been on.

00:18:10: As in, Mamut is also competing against the North Face, Patagonia, Arcterix, and there are many resemblances between the Brooks journey and the Mamut journey.

00:18:20: And Jim, the author, is a fantastic person.

00:18:22: So it's a great book.

00:18:23: I really loved it.

00:18:24: And people, I've given the book to a few people and I think they've enjoyed it too.

00:18:28: Great.

00:18:29: Do you have a life motto, a credo, a mission statement you live by?

00:18:33: Yeah, I think it's probably the one around discomfort.

00:18:37: Embrace discomfort to create growth.

00:18:40: I think that's because I would say almost every day there's an opportunity for this, right?

00:18:47: There's always things that are unexpected.

00:18:49: And of course, you know, you miss the train, whatever.

00:18:51: I mean, that's not real discomfort.

00:18:53: But I think you can find it.

00:18:54: It applies to everyday life.

00:18:56: It applies very much so to business life.

00:18:58: It applies to family life.

00:19:01: But it takes courage and it takes energy.

00:19:04: Greg, final question.

00:19:05: How will AI improve your life in two years?

00:19:10: That's a great question.

00:19:12: I mean maybe the first thing.

00:19:14: up until now, I think I probably do fifty, sixty percent more in a week than what I used to do.

00:19:23: And I do a lot of it better.

00:19:25: And I feel like I have a superpower that can think with me strategically, brainstorm with me, it writes all my emails, it does all my research, I have lots of automations.

00:19:36: So I think now I feel like I have a competitive edge over everyone else.

00:19:40: And that's quite nice, especially when you're competitive like myself.

00:19:44: For like two years from now, that's a very long time for AI.

00:19:53: What I would like to have is actually coming back to the superpower, to have agents that I know are working for me when I turn off the switch, to take a break, relax, sit on the sofa.

00:20:08: But at the same time, I'm still achieving the goals that I'd like to achieve.

00:20:11: Maybe that's to have those agents working for me so I can turn off the switch

00:20:15: and find the super power.

00:20:16: Greg, Nicky in the house.

00:20:18: Thank you so much for being here on the podcast.

00:20:20: It was a real pleasure.

00:20:21: I wish you all the best for your future endeavors

00:20:24: and hope to talk to you soon.

00:20:25: Great.

00:20:26: Thank you, Jakob.

00:20:35: Capricorn Connect.

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